Trinity Doctrine Again?
- HouseFire
- Feb 17
- 12 min read
We die if we see God? And yet humans have seen God in the OT? How is this so?
Genesis 32:30 And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved.
Exodus 20:19 And they said unto Moses, Speak thou with us, and we will hear: but let not God speak with us, lest we die.
Deuteronomy 4:33 Did ever people hear the voice of God speaking out of the midst of the fire, as thou hast heard, and live?
Deuteronomy 5:24-27 (26) For who is there of all flesh, that hath heard the voice of the living God speaking out of the midst of the fire, as we have, and lived?
Deuteronomy 18:16 According to all that thou desiredst of the LORD thy God in Horeb in the day of the assembly, saying, Let me not hear again the voice of the LORD my God, neither let me see this great fire any more, that I die not.
Judges 6:22-23 And when Gideon perceived that he was an angel of the LORD, Gideon said, Alas, O Lord GOD! for because I have seen an angel of the LORD face to face. (23) And the LORD said unto him, Peace be unto thee; fear not: thou shalt not die.
Judges 13:22 And Manoah said unto his wife, We shall surely die, because we have seen God.
Isaiah 6:5 Then said I, Woe is me! for I am undone; because I am a man of unclean lips, and I dwell in the midst of a people of unclean lips: for mine eyes have seen the King, the LORD of hosts.
(Just some notes to make a point and further a study for those who want to investigate).
Humans know, that if they see God Jehovah, that they will die. And so anyone who sees an Holy Angel with such glory and brightness, they only assume that is God and surely they will die. But when they see an Angel of the Lord, who does not refuse worship and is named Jehovah God, these people do not die. And so who is this "Angel of the Lord"? Why would God allow an "Angel" to be called Jehovah? Perhaps there is more to the story than meets the eye?
These are just some verses to help you (the reader) investigate further into the question of "Angel of the Lord" and why did humans not die when they saw Jehovah God? There can be more verses listed, but just making a point to further examine the topic about the Trinity Doctrine and why people believe the Trinity is a good Biblical Doctrine. Even those in the Old Testament did not understand what they were writing about as they were writing the Old Testament.
Secret: (65 verses found, 68 matches) I show 2.
Deuteronomy 29:29 The secret things belong unto the LORD our God: but those things which are revealed belong unto us and to our children for ever, that we may do all the words of this law.
Isaiah 48:16 Come ye near unto me, hear ye this; I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; from the time that it was, there am I: and now the Lord GOD, and his Spirit, hath sent me.
Just search about secret and read in context what might be talked about. And also search Mystery. What is this Mystery? Is God keeping secrets from us? Yes God is keeping secrets, of course He is, but what is given to us is for us to know and everything written down is for our edification (Deuteronomy 29:29).
2 Timothy 3:16-17 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: (17) That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
Mystery: (22 verses found, 22 matches)
Mrk_4:11 And he said unto them, unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:
>Rom_11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.
>Rom_16:25 Now to him that is of power to stablish you according to my gospel, and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery, which was kept secret since the world began,
>1Co_2:7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:
>1Co_15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
>Eph_1:9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:
>Eph_3:3 How that by revelation he made known unto me the mystery; (as I wrote afore in few words,
>Eph_3:4 Whereby, when ye read, ye may understand my knowledge in the mystery of Christ)
>Eph_3:9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
>Eph_5:32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.
>Eph_6:19 And for me, that utterance may be given unto me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known the mystery of the gospel,
>Col_1:26 Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:
>Col_1:27 To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:
>Col_2:2 That their hearts might be comforted, being knit together in love, and unto all riches of the full assurance of understanding, to the acknowledgement of the mystery of God, and of the Father, and of Christ;
>Col_4:3 Withal praying also for us, that God would open unto us a door of utterance, to speak the mystery of Christ, for which I am also in bonds:
>2Th_2:7 For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.
>1Ti_3:9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.
>1Ti_3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
>Rev_1:20 The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.
>Rev_10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets.
>Rev_17:5 And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.
>Rev_17:7 And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns.
And with that all said, here is the Angel of the Lord search with some other verses and some links at the bottom to further your search. That is, if you even read this far.
Genesis 1:1-2 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. (2) And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the **Spirit of God** moved upon the face of the waters.
Who is the "**Spirit of God**", and why is it separate from God?
Genesis 16:7-13 Angel of the Lord... And she called the name of the LORD that spake unto her, Thou God seest me: for she said, Have I also here looked after him that seeth me?
Genesis 17:1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the** LORD appeared to Abram**, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect.
Genesis 18:1 (entire chapter) **And the LORD appeared unto him** in the plains of Mamre: and he sat in the tent door in the heat of the day;
Gen 16-18 and so forth has alot of God speaking to humans and seen by humans while in Gen 18, God **Yehovah **(H3068) is seen **eating flesh with Abraham**and spent a lot of hours with Abraham before He left (alot of hours because it takes time to fetch a animal, kill it, skin it and dress it and cook it and then clean up yourself when done.
Genesis 32:24-30 (24) And Jacob was left alone; and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day. (30) And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel: for** I have seen God face to face**, and my life is preserved.
Exodus 3:2 And the** angel of the LORD** appeared unto him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush: and he looked, and, behold, the bush burned with fire, and the bush was not consumed. (3:6) Moreover he said,** I am the God of thy father**, the **God of Abraham**, the **God of Isaac**, and the **God of Jacob**. And Moses hid his face; for he was afraid to look upon God.
Angel of the Lord is speaking from the burning bush? And claims to be God?
Numbers 22:22-38 And Balaam said unto Balak, Lo, I am come unto thee: have I now any power at all to say any thing? the word that God putteth in my mouth, that shall I speak.
Donkey sees Angel of the Lord story.
Joshua 5:14-15 And he said, Nay; but as** captain of the host of the LORD** am I now come. And Joshua fell on his face to the earth,** and did worship**, and said unto him, What saith my lord unto his servant? (15) And the **captain of the LORD'S** host said unto Joshua, Loose thy shoe from off thy foot; for the place **whereon thou standest is holy**. And Joshua did so.
The angel does not refuse worship, and the ground is also Holy. Angels who are created are not to accept worship correct???
Judges 6:11-23 And the LORD said unto him, Peace be unto thee; fear not: thou shalt not die.
>Judges 13:18 And the **angel of the LORD** said unto him, Why askest thou thus after **my name**, seeing it is **secret**?
>Judges 13:22 And Manoah said unto his wife, **We shall ****surely die, because we have seen God**.
Isaiah 9:6 For unto us a** child is born**, unto us a **son is given**: and the **government shall be upon his shoulder**: and his name shall be called** Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace.**
A child born is** The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace**???
Isaiah 44:6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; **I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God.**
Self evident in the verse that God is God and no other is God but Him alone. But I ask: Who is the redeemer in this verse? God has a redeemer? Or our redeemer is with God? what is this verse saying?
Zechariah 1:7–10 (10)And the man that stood among the myrtle trees answered and said, These are they whom the LORD hath sent to walk to and fro through the earth. (11) And they answered the angel of the LORD that stood among the myrtle trees, and said, We have walked to and fro through the earth, and, behold, all the earth sitteth still, and is at rest.
Gotta go and read this. Look for yourself and ask, who is speaking to who?
Zechariah (3:2) (KJV) And the LORD said unto Satan, The **LORD rebuke thee**, O Satan; even the LORD that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee: is not this a brand plucked out of the fire? (**Darby**) And Jehovah said unto Satan, **Jehovah rebuke thee**, O Satan! Yea, Jehovah that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee! Is not this a brand plucked out of the fire? (**ASV**) And Jehovah said unto Satan, **Jehovah rebuke thee**, O Satan; yea, Jehovah that hath chosen Jerusalem rebuke thee: is not this a brand plucked out of the fire?
Isn't the Lord Yehovah the only God? Why is Yehovah saying Yehovah rebuke you? Sounds like that Jude verse?
Jude 1:9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, **The Lord rebuke thee**.
Lord Yehovah says Yehovah rebuke thee, and Michael the ArchAngel also says the Lord rebuke thee. Another topic to think about. ( How many times is God referred to as an angel in the Bible? )
Matthew 2:11 And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down**, and worshipped him**: and when they had opened their treasures, they presented unto him gifts; gold, and frankincense, and myrrh.
Just like Isaiah 9:6, a child God? A child who is God?
Matthew 28:9 And as they went to tell his disciples, behold, Jesus met them, saying, All hail. And they came and held him by the feet,** and worshipped him**.
Acts 7:30-38 (35) This **Moses **whom they refused, saying, Who made thee a ruler and a judge? the same did **God **send to be a ruler and a deliverer by the hand of the** angel which appeared to him in the bush**. (38) This is he, that was in the church in the wilderness with the angel which spake to him in the mount Sina, and with our fathers: who received the lively oracles to give unto us:
What is being said here in Acts 7? I thought God was in the burning bush? It was an angel?
Colossians 1:15-18 Who is the**image of the invisible God**, the firstborn of every creature: (16) For by**him were all things created**, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: **all things were created by him, and for him:** (17) And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. (18) And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
John 1:3 **All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made**.
John Entire book of John, pretty much entire New Testament is all about Jesus and His Divinity.
Revelation 1:8 **I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending**, saith the Lord, **which is, and which was, and which is to come**, the Almighty. (11) Saying,**I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last**: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea. (17-18) And when I saw him, I fell at his feet as dead. And he laid his right hand upon me, saying unto me, **Fear not; I am the first and the last**: (18) **I am he that liveth, and was dead**; and, behold,** I am alive for evermore, Amen**; and have the keys of hell and of death.
Revelation 2:8 And unto the angel of the church in Smyrna write;** These things saith the first and the last, which was dead, and is alive (KJV). "'The First and the Last, who once was dead but came to life again, speaks as follows** (Williams). "'**This is what the First and the Last says--He who died and has returned to life** (Weymouth).** Who was dead and came to life** (LEB). **Who died and lived again** (GNB).“And to the angel of the congregation in Smyrʹna write: These are the things that he says, ‘the First and the Last,’ who became dead and came to life again (NWT)
Revelation 22:12-13 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be. (13)** I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.**
More can be said and provided but this is all for now. Just notes, not a real post. Plz see the links below and like I always tell people, ... Don't believe me blindly, but investigate. Don't believe "Man" blindly but investigate. As many people believe in their "Preacher" without question, and that is dangerous if you want to know truth and your Salvation might be at stake depending on what is being taught. The Bible is full of Jesus, but only if you search for Him, will you see Him.
Luke 24:27 And beginning at Moses and all the prophets,** he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.**
Acts 28:23 And when they had appointed him a day, there came many to him into his lodging; to whom he expounded and testified the kingdom of God, **persuading them concerning Jesus, both out of the law of Moses, and out of the prophets**, from morning till evening.
Jesus taught His disciples where He was in the Old Testament. Disciples later taught others where to find Jesus in the Old Testament??? God bless you and your study concerning Jesus and what the disciples had to do with the Jews concerning Jesus.
Commentary for English Readers:
Extra links for further examination on why people believe Jesus is God just as said in John 1: Word is God and Word became flesh etc etc...
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